DE Insurance - Progressive

[Eric]

This has been discussed on other threads, but I thought it would be better to start fresh. Based on some of what I have heard about coverage at Driver's Education events, I went to look at what Progressive has to offer. Attached is my dialog. The summary is yes, they will cover DE, regardless of the surface, as long as it is not a race. More details when I get paperwork.

This is also linked on the fledgling Insurance page....

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The following is a copy of an email exchange that I had with Progressive Insurance. It good news for those of us looking for someone who will provide coverage at a Drivers Education course, regardless of the venue. I will post more when I get the list of exclusions and the actual policy.

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Dear Mr. Jenney,

Thank you for contacting Progressive Direct. I am happy to answer your additional question.

As long as you are not in a race this course would be acceptable.

We appreciate the time you took to explore our Web site and quote a new policy with Progressive Direct. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this e-mail or contact us at 1-800-PROGRESSIVE (1-800-776-4737). Our licensed Sales Representatives are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to assist you.

Sincerely,

LaShunda Washington
Progressive Direct Internet Service Specialist

--- Original Message ---
From: Eric Jenney <ejenney@charter.net>
Received: 02/23/2007 10:19pm Eastern Standard Time (GMT - 5:00 )
To: John Taylor <quoting@progressivedirect.com>
Subject: Re: Your Progressive Quote

John,

Does it matter where the Driver's Education course is to be held? The
one that I am thinking of attending is to be held at Brainerd
International Raceway. I've heard of other policies that specifically
exclude ANY activities that take place off public roads on dedicated
tracks.

Thanks,

Eric
-----------------------------------------------------------------
John Taylor wrote:
Dear Mr. Jenney,

Thank you for your reply. We appreciate your interest in our company.

I have submitted a request to our Typing Department to issue a policy contract to you via US Mail. Please allow 5 to 7 days for delivery. Coverage would be provided for you while you are using your car to complete the driver's education course; however, please note that we currently do not offer a driver's education course discount in your state.

We appreciate the time you took to explore our Web site and quote a new policy with Progressive Direct. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this e-mail or contact us at 1-800-PROGRESSIVE (1-800-776-4737). Our licensed Sales Representatives are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to assist you.

Sincerely,

John Taylor
Progressive Direct Internet Service Specialist

--- Original Message ---
From: Eric Jenney <ejenney@charter.net>
Received: 02/23/2007 01:24pm Eastern Standard Time (GMT - 5:00 )
To: Sara Jamjoom <quoting@progressivedirect.com>
Subject: Re: Your Progressive Quote

Sara,

If you could send a copy of the policy and exclusions to
Eric Jenney
xxxx xxxxxxxxxx xx xx
xxxxxxxxxxx,xx xxxxx

That would be great.

The Driver's Education to which I am referring is one of several
sponsored by car clubs, in which instruction on car control and driving
is given in a classroom, and then students are sent out on a closed
course (not public roads) to practice. I would be using my own car,
and no one else would be driving it. In some of the sessions, an
instructor may accompany me in the car, but there will not be any other
students in my car.

Hope that helps, Thank you!

Eric Jenney

----------------------------------------------------
Sara Jamjoom wrote:

Dear Mr. Jenney,

Thank you for your interest in Progressive Direct.

You have requested a list of exclusions, I am able to fax or mail you a sample policy contract for you to review. The contact does list some exclusions. If you would like this done, please reply with a fax number or mailing address.

You mentioned Drivers Education Sessions. Could you please reply with some additional information regarding how your vehicle may be used in relation to these courses. If you are taking a driving course and using your own car, you would still be covered. If you are a defensive driving instructor and using your vehicle for others it would not be covered.

We appreciate the time you took to explore our Web site and quote a new policy with Progressive Direct. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this e-mail or contact us at 1-800-PROGRESSIVE (1-800-776-4737). Our licensed Sales Representatives are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to assist you.

Sincerely,

Sara Jamjoom
Progressive Direct Internet Service Specialist

--- Original Message ---
From: <ejenney@charter.net>
Received: 02/23/2007 12:09pm Eastern Standard Time (GMT - 5:00 )
To: <quoting@progressivedirect.com>
Subject: Your Progressive Quote

======================================
MESSAGE CONTENT
======================================
Message: Can I see the actual policy, or a list of exclusions?
Specifically, I am wondering if the policy covers Driver's Education
sessions such as those provided by BMW and/or PCA clubs.
Marketing Agr: NO
Personal CC: NO

======================================
SESSION INFORMATION
======================================

[Stack]

Eric... this is promising. Please keep us updated.

I still get the impression they think its something similar to a state run driving school. I imagine if you were to ask with different wording, such as High Performance driving school, or somehow work in the fact that it is high speed car control, the answer would be quite different.

[Stack]

The biggest problem in my view with the whole situation is the utter lack of education of the right people. As soon as you say that you are doing a track event, people immediately assume you're racing. No matter how many times you explain (or try to explain), until they actually see and experience for themselves what its about, the only frame of reference they have is NASCAR. And THAT my friends, is not a good thing.

Even if they know, they can't stop using that damn word... racing. Anytime I take a Friday off or something the first thing anyone asks me "you racin' this weekend?"

[billy]

Yep
I don't trust em, I think Stack is right, they think its a state run thing.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by billy

Yep
I don't trust em, I think Stack is right, they think its a state run thing.

I'll post exclusions and policy when I get it. Notice in the dialog that I specifically called out that it would be run by car clubs, like PCA or BMW.

[gangstafoot]

Call me crazy (or selfish) but I'm okay with insurance people not having much of an education about the differences. If they were to start understanding the differences between event types, they'd start dictating what I can drive and where. They're already witlessly discounting (or inflating) rates based upon the use of the vehicle for "work or school" not to mention my mailing address. Some have wised up and begun asking where the car is parked at night. Giving them more delimiters to raise or lower my premiums is not something I'm in favor of. No, I don't even tell them that I attend driver education events. I have no delusions of lowering my rates for having learned more since highschool drivers ed... the level most drivers last completed.

No, if something happened and it happened on a track, I was attending driver improvement training. And it was after the fact of my coverage that did not exclude anything but timed competition and I was not violating our terms.

[Rob.wisniewski]

I think where alot of the questions are coming in gangstafoot is exactly that.. not so much premiums, but actually paying up when something DOES go wrong. And as much as we'd like to think we've got the ability to push our logic into their hands, they've got alot more pull and sway to go ahead and NOT pay up, and put up quite the court case if they really don't feel the need to.

[gangstafoot]

That's why I'm against giving them more arrows or helping them sharpen the ones they have. There has been a steady growth of driver education programs at many levels for a few years now. It is resulting in better drivers when they go home for the simple fact of having practiced significantly above the limits of street driving. Insurance restrictions would squash that for guys with daily-drivers (like me) and pose a huuuuge hurdle for newcomers. Noobs are already afraid they're going to crash their cars or that they haven't got enough mods done.

I encourage first-timers to drive exactly what they're driving now for this reason. They'll know their equipment better for it. When starting out, it is the driver that is being improved most. When the driver is better than the car, then the car is ripe to be built upon... not the other way around.

Who does Joe Insurance Writer think he is raising rates on drivers now better prepared for extreme handling demands? He's looking down his nose at the driver who dared put rubber to private tarmac and stopping there with his instant excuse not to pay. He's already got riders and additional premiums to cover the all-too-easy-to-bolt-on "performance" parts most newbies get sucked into first.

No way. I'm going with the dumb policy that has no idea driver education has continued past highschool. I'd love it if there were a system of rewarding higher educated drivers (safer imho) but there isn't.

[Stack]

Originally Posted by gangstafoot

Call me crazy (or selfish) but I'm okay with insurance people not having much of an education about the differences. If they were to start understanding the differences between event types, they'd start dictating what I can drive and where. They're already witlessly discounting (or inflating) rates based upon the use of the vehicle for "work or school" not to mention my mailing address. Some have wised up and begun asking where the car is parked at night. Giving them more delimiters to raise or lower my premiums is not something I'm in favor of. No, I don't even tell them that I attend driver education events. I have no delusions of lowering my rates for having learned more since highschool drivers ed... the level most drivers last completed.

No, if something happened and it happened on a track, I was attending driver improvement training. And it was after the fact of my coverage that did not exclude anything but timed competition and I was not violating our terms.

I was wondering when this issue might come up. I've thought about this too... and I don't necessarily disagree with you... but restricting which events you can attend is better than the alternative: telling you you can't attend any events at all. Right? As far as raising my premium because I participate in track events... hey, small price to pay if it means I'll be covered (I'd pay another $200-$300 a year for guaranteed coverage, wouldn't you?). Even if it meant that some events would be covered, some would not, at least you'll have a choice and you'll know ahead of time.

No coverage on track doesn't bother me that much because I've always assumed the risk and I drive accordingly, as have (I think) most everyone else that starts this sport with their street car. What scares me are the rumors of premiums being raised because of questions about coverage being asked, or worse, policies being dropped (due to a claim or not).

[sbarton]

I just reviewed my Progressive Direct policy (NJ) and it specifically
"Excludes damage resulting from, or sustained during practice
or preparation for:
(a) any pre-arranged or organized racing, stunting,
speed, or demolition contest or activity; or
(b) any driving activity conducted on a permanent
or temporary racetrack or racecourse;"

When I was in NY I called and they said the same thing. What state is your Progressive Direct Policy from?

-Scott